“welcome hello lovely to see you all
uh i’m martha i am your trainer for
today i’m training on behalf of the
money charity on behalf of the seafarers
charity as part of the wider safety net
campaign in this financial champions
supporting fishers
uh piece of work for you all
um
hopefully as i said today is going to be
both enjoyable and informative
for you all and what we’re about today
is about helping you to help fishers
to get the information that they need to
manage their finances better so it’s not
about you becoming incredible financial
experts um or you know perfect fountains
of all knowledge being able to give
loads of great advice
but it is about you being able to point
fishes in the right direction
now in order that we can tell something
about how effective or otherwise this
training is
i’m going to
do a quick poll with you all to find out
how you are already how confident you
are already and we’ll do another poll at
the end as well to see what’s changed so
a
quick poll right at the beginning
so
we’ve got a spectrum here
um
of different results i’m just going to
make a quick
note of those
um
but broadly
yeah broadly we’ve got a spectrum across
the way
um
of how people feel and hopefully by the
end this is going to tilt
more towards the people who
feel really confident and feel good
about their ability to support fishers
with their finances
bab okay
thank you very much
all right so let’s get going
um
first of all
uh i want to make sure that you all have
a
really great resource that we have put
together to support you in what we’re
doing so you’re not going away thinking
oh
i’m gonna have to learn all this stuff
and then just remember it and i’ve got
to have it all memorized there’s
actually a nice resource that we’ve put
together people download
print off keep to hand so i’m just going
to pop a link to that in your chat there
um and i’m sure that will be available
from seafarers charity in future as well
when you need it um i have popped the
link in the chat there so you can
download that resource um but let’s get
on with the session because it is a
packed session today we want to try and
get through everything
so it’s 90 minutes plus another 15
minutes for harriet who is going to be
talking about safetynet campaign which
is a broader campaign sits around this
money champions are part of a whole
programme of work to help
fishers and people it just in the
fishing industry to improve their
financial situation particularly fishers
and uh sheriff fisherman in particular
we
will be taking questions in the chat um
it says questions in chat we answered at
the end of the webinar um to be honest
just throw them in there as we go
through questions and thoughts i love
getting your feedback in the um
in the chat so even if you just go in do
an mlg give me a thumbs up as we’re
going i love that that’s great so
digital handouts i’ve already popped one
in there once i’m going to while i think
about it put another one in there that’s
that’s really useful which is a plain
english guide
to
the language of money to financial
jargon
which i really love
um
honestly half of dealing with your money
is understanding the language right so
put a nice little plain english guide to
some of the money language that’s out
there if you download those two they’re
gonna really help you out
okay
some expectation setting we’re not
expecting you as many champions to
perform miracles right nobody’s going to
expect you to double a fish’s income or
suddenly make everybody who talks to you
rich or um suddenly give everybody
perfect money skills from doing this
it’s not about that it’s about giving
you the ability to
be supportive in the right in a helpful
way in the right way um to
give reliable information to point
people towards the right sources of
information the right source of advice
at the right time um so that people get
the help they need um and fishers can um
you know have a first port of call as it
were in you and you’ll be able to then
direct them onwards to some of the other
really great advice and information
that’s out there for them okay
so
um
here is what we are going to talk about
we’re going to talk about the difference
between giving financial advice and then
what you’re going to be doing which is
about support information and guidance
so where is that line into advice that
you don’t want to cross we’re going to
talk about that we’re going to talk
about how do you stay the right side of
that and just give information and
guidance and support
i’m going to talk about tax national
insurance and how important that is
that’s a major area where a lot of
people who um are fishing get into a lot
of trouble we’re going to talk about
sign posting fishes to tools and
resources
how to make a spending plan how to help
them smooth out their income because we
all know that fishing incomes
rise fall they can be lumpy they can be
unpredictable
obviously they’re seasonal so all of
those kind of things just about bit
about smoothing that income out
we’re going to talk about the idea of
good and bad debt and how do we um
you know make sure that people stay away
from bad debt
and priority and non-priority debt so if
somebody doesn’t have the money to cover
all of their
bills and expenses
what’s the absolute essentials that they
really need to make sure are covered
what’s priority and then where are the
consequences less severe if they can’t
make that payment
something about the cost of borrowing
money as well
uh we’re going to talk about credit
unions a little bit and comsave which is
the new credit union for the fishing
industry
borrowing from licensed lenders and
staying away from informal borrowing
from friends and family
the risks that are around that
and particularly loan sharks the dangers
of loan sharks in your community how to
spot them what could do if you know that
there is a loan mark in your local area
some of the organizations providing
independent free debt and money advice
and how to sign post effectively to
those
so that people you’re speaking to get
the advice that they need
okay
so starting off
quick fire in the chat why do you think
it’s so important that fishers get the
money skills have the right money skills
why do they need really good money
skills
but some of them given you some thoughts
already but why is it so important that
they have really good money skills
put your thoughts in the chat
irregular income yep being self-employed
yes it’s an unpredictable occupation
it’s difficult to manage any regular
income yep it’s not consistent exactly
landings are not reliable
definitely
that’s you absolutely hit the nail on
the head that’s the biggest one
remaining solvent especially if they
have a family yes definitely being able
to plan ahead for bad markets definitely
all of those things indeed really really
important
and coming off the back of that
um we also have lack of financial skills
yet unpredictable rising costs of fuel
yeah i hadn’t had that one but
absolutely that’s important supporting
an extended family network potentially
yeah
absolutely
coming off the back of that so we’ve got
a whole bunch of things that come away
from that self-employment and
unpredictable income
um
there are
aspects that where the income is
unreliable even when you’re fit and well
but you’ve got weather injury boat
repairs things that can knock somebody
out of action for a while
and an unpredictable income leads to
difficulty borrowing it’s very hard to
have a good credit score when your
income is unpredictable
which then leads to difficulty borrowing
at a reasonable cost
benefit system is not designed to work
well with this kind of income
and lifestyle
and so there’s a whole kind of raft of
issues that come off from that irregular
income and self-employment coming from
loss of income yeah lots of equipment
storms etc
being responsible for tax ni all of that
stuff planning for retirement yeah it’s
hard to do all of that stuff
for yourself there’s not an employer
doing it for you
and
so there’s a whole raft of things that
mean that fishes need to be above
average in terms of
how competent they are and how
determined they are to manage their
money well
so
if you needed to talk to somebody about
your money what would you want
so you’re going to be there to be a
person that people will talk to about
their money
what kind of treatment would you want if
you’re going to have talked to somebody
about your money how do you want to be
treated
by that person
you listen to yes absolutely super
important
what else
you listen to and
to be understood yeah honesty yeah
yeah empathy non-judgment respect great
answers coming through in the chat here
as an adult yeah you don’t want to be
patronized right empathetic
knowledgeable not a salesperson really
important right discretion yeah privacy
is a big deal right with money you need
an expert okay
i’m going to say something you need
somebody who
in with that honesty
says this is what i know this is what i
don’t know and this he
can refer to an expert doesn’t try and
blag it and say that they know more than
they do
communicating in language i understand
absolutely confidential simple
straightforward words all of that
absolutely one of the reasons why the
first thing i did was to give you that
plain english jargon buster
um because it’s so important to be
speaking people’s language yeah
fantastic all of this is really great
um so
here are some top tips about having a
good conversation about money we want to
speak in private make sure we’re going
to be really clear that we’re going to
keep anything personal confidential
we’re not trying to make any personal
gain out of this so we’re not um being a
salesperson as somebody said
we’re listening carefully we’re not
assuming anything about somebody’s
situation we’re just acting on what they
tell us so not trying to get ahead of
ourselves being honest say how you can
help how you can’t help when you can
refer
who else could be helpful
not pushing somebody towards a specific
solution you’re letting them choose and
that’s part of that yeah don’t over
promise and under deliver definitely
exactly part of that treating people
like an adult
is about giving them the choice right so
we’re not just saying this is the right
thing for you to do just go off and do
what i tell you because i’m telling you
what to do
no we’re giving them the range of
options the pros and cons of those
options and then letting them choose
because they’re responsible for what
they’re going to do
simple clear explanations referring to
experts when necessary and we’re looking
at the future lots of people said
empathy and lack of
non-judgment so we’re not judging what
people have done in the past you might
think oh how could you get into a mess
like that
but that’s not what it’s about it’s
about future actions supporting people
to make responsible wise choices
for their future from now on so many
people who come for money advices are
ashamed and so hard on themselves
already that actually
you know
you getting on top of them as well is
you’re only adding on to that it’s not
helpful
step by step supporting them through
yeah
yeah so somebody to be with them through
it
as much as you can although we don’t
expect you to
um put huge amounts of time into any
specific person’s case and kind of take
over doing everything with them but you
know like as
within your role you know being
supportive being there for them
okay
so
sounds like you’re really on this that’s
fantastic
okay so let’s talk about this guidance
advice issue this is really important
want to get this to you straight away
right at the top
so
advice financial advice is a regulated
term so let’s talk about the difference
between guidance and giving advice
financial advice is what financial
advisors
planners
um and people who are in a right in
regulated financial advice in financial
services do debt advisors also have to
be regulated and they give advice so
when you see that word advice in
somebody’s
job role around money they should be
authorized regulated and properly
qualified
by the financial conduct authority
um
and the reason is because advice is
about giving somebody a recommendation
about what they should
do
so it’s a tailored solution
based on somebody’s personal
circumstances
based on their objectives based on what
they’ve said they want
and it’s specific
it says you should
take out a specific product or stop
using a specific product
or um
you should go to a specific provider
it’s
um it’s all about that you should take
this solution
and
not only are we saying don’t do it
because you have to be authorized you
have to be regulated you have to be
properly insured all of that stuff yes
but it’s also about responsibility right
so when you give advice a person who
gives advice in a financial sense
gives advice
is to some extent taking on the
responsibility for that being the right
advice
whereas what we want you to do is to
give guidance and with guidance
the
person the the other person retains the
responsibility for the choice they make
okay so what is guidance let’s talk
about the other side of it this is what
we want you to do
guidance
helps a person to understand what they
could
do
so advice this is what you should do
this is the solution for you
we think this is the right thing
guidance on the other hand
as opposed to advice
a guidance says these are some things
that you could do these are the
advantages and disadvantages of those
some general types of products some
general principles
there is no personal recommendation
there is no specific
solution offered it’s just these are
potential
options for you
let’s help you understand those
what’s good and what’s not so good about
them and you can make a decision about
what’s right for you
it’s not regulated anybody can give
guidance um and so
because it’s not about you taking the
responsibility
for giving for what what the person does
because you’re not specifically saying
one solution
hopefully that makes sense to everybody
what that difference is
um
so we’re going to do a quick uh
a quick kind of
run through of the the whys which i’ve
talked about a bit already
um and then we’ll do a quick poll and
you can confirm to me that you have got
this
um so i’ve already said giving advice
makes you responsible i’ve already
mentioned about the regulated advisors
aspect
a couple of things as well guidance
helps fishers learn to solve their own
problems in future so guidance is more
educational than advice
with advice often
the person who’s seeking advice goes
just take this problem away from me and
the advisor goes yeah sure i’ve taken
the problem away from me here’s the
solution
um whereas guidance helps the person
learn to solve their own problems in
future
and when a person makes a choice for
themselves
as they do in a guidance situation it’s
like it’s their choice they own it
they’re responsible for it there’s no
pushback of oh well this person told me
to do it but actually i don’t like it so
i’m not going to bother you don’t get
that that pushback aspect so
psychologically there’s some an element
of the responsibility taking that can be
really valuable too
okay so
quick poll let’s see do we think this is
advice or do we think this is guidance
and it’s okay
so official tells you they’ve been
saving money for emergencies in drawing
their house and you say um
that’s not safe what if it gets stolen
you have to get a savings account you
should get a savings account with
halifax then nice in there talk to
sherry she’s great she’ll get you a good
deal
so uh quick poll
is that advice or is that guidance
remember advice
it’s all about telling people what they
should do guidance is about telling
people what they could do
so guidance is the one we want to stick
with advice is the one we want to stay
away from
okay
three
two
one i’m going to close the poll
um and here we go most people have got
that right
um this is advice you want to stick well
clear of this
in this uh we’re telling the person
where to go what product to get we’re
telling them what bank to go to we’re
even telling them what advisor to speak
to in the bank so that’s very much
specific tailored advice and that’s what
we want to steer well clear of okay so
definitely that is advice
um
so
let’s do another one of these
just to make sure you’ve got it
uh
we
have official come to us and they say
they need to get a personal loan they
think the bank’s not going to lend them
the money
they say what would you do
you say well
i can’t say
i’m not in that in your position i can
talk to you about some of the things
that you could do
um here’s some information about how to
choose a loan with low fees and interest
rates
you show them how to use a comparison
site potentially you also mentioned that
comm save credit union exists
and it has a specific product for
fishers
um and the fisher looks at the offers on
the comparison site has a chat with
comsave in the end they think comp saves
the right thing for them and they borrow
from comm save
so
is that advice or is that guidance
and tina has put the comm save link into
the chat thank you very much tina that’s
fantastic
okay
give me another couple of seconds get
those answers in there as quick as
possible
okay okay keep it moving
right
three two one
boom
and there we go again
almost everybody got that one right that
is guidance so even though we have said
mentioned a specific provider all we’ve
done is say they exist right
we haven’t said they’re the right thing
for you we haven’t said that the only
solution
um and
many fishers will not know about the
existence of compsave
so because they don’t know that that
exists
they would not otherwise have that as an
option so we’re just saying like look
these are these options exist and then
this option also exists that does have a
specific product but i’m not saying
it’s the right thing i’m just saying it
exists
and
advantages and disadvantages so
you’re okay with that it is within the
guidance
and you’re all right to do that and as i
said tina has already dropped the link
in there so fab thank you very much tina
um
all right so let’s talk about
some quickly some frustrations sometimes
uh people really want advice they just
want to be told what to do
um and it can be really tempting
especially when there is one really
clear obvious choice that’s the right
thing for somebody to do very tempting
to just tell them that just do this but
you cannot do it you can’t even just
hint
and people will do things like say
um well what would you do
and you have to say well i’m not you so
our situation is different so i can’t
tell you it’s your choice
so
make sure you’re always batting that
back to that person ultimately they have
to be responsible for their own decision
you’re guiding you’re supporting but you
cannot recommend a specific course of
action
um with regards to products
okay um
these are some signs from step change
that you might want to watch out for
um that somebody is struggling
financially so as a money champion
you’re going to want to kind of be aware
of these signals that this might be
somebody that you want to just check in
with make sure they’re okay
so history of debt problems
seeming tired difficulty sleeping debt
stress often causes people to have
sleepless nights doesn’t want to get
together sort of spending more time by
themselves borrowing to pay food or
essentials
if you know something that might cause a
recent loss of income
they seem to be way living beyond their
means um and they the income you know of
and their lifestyle don’t match up
if they’re borrowing early um soon after
a catch soon after getting paid
um
or you see kind of changes in behavior
that implies somebody’s struggling um
and again you know you might not
personally see this but if you notice
that their
bills are unopened or they’re being
really cagey around money that might be
a sign too
okay suppose spending plans as opposed
to budgets
we avoid the b word just because a lot
of people have negative associations
with it a spending plan sounds like
something somebody might want to do as
opposed to a budget which lots of people
don’t want to do but
um you know it’s up to you we have in
the
uh
document that i’ve already put into the
chat once but i’m going to do it again
and in the
um
there we go
there it is make sure everybody gets
that download
and in all the resources that you will
get
from the safety net later um there’s a
nice planning sheet to help people to
plan their money um to make a spending
plan for matching and making sure that
their outgoings are not higher than
their incoming
understanding where their money is going
and how they can plan
not just for the day-to-day bills but
also those occasional expenses that come
up that can really throw people so
things that knock people’s spending out
of whack apart from an unexpectedly long
time between
um ability to earn things that throw
people things like birthdays christmas
you’d think um because they come around
the same time every year you’d expect
people to have the money for them but no
lots of people don’t plan in their
spending plans for those things and
actually it’s really important they do
which is one of the reason why
this budget planner sheet which looks
super detailed and a bit intimidating to
some people it’s not it’s just there to
remind you of all those things that you
might otherwise forget
like
mots
like boat insurance we haven’t got boat
insurance in there because it’s a
generic one but we do have insurance
annual insurance payments in there
and boat insurance has probably got to
be in in the high uh top ones for those
um things like you know household
repairs and replacements
those sort of throw people out of wax
those occasional expenses making sure
that
there’s money going aside every month
so that when those big things come round
as they do maybe once every six months
once a year there’s something in the pot
already for them and we’re not
scrambling and cutting back on
everything else that month
um
there is also an online money charity
bunny budget builder so people who don’t
want to have to do the maths themselves
which you have to do with a paper form
can
find online planners that will do it for
you they do all your maths all you do is
plug in the right numbers um which you
should use
uh the real figures really important
when you’re talking to
um fishers about planning their spending
that they have to use the actual real
numbers
from their own bills from their bank
statements
um from their receipts and not just
optimistically make it up because
otherwise it’s not a plan it’s just a
daydream
right got to make sure it’s based on
real numbers
there are lots of other places online
that you can also get these things so
money helper fantastic website loads of
free information completely independent
um run by the government so it’s it’s
just a completely
independent from all financial services
it’s not trying to sell you anything
um and that has loads of information and
that includes a budget planner citizens
advice which you may well have heard of
um
they have a budget planner an online one
as well where you can plug your figures
in um money saving expert which is a
for-profit website
um but it does have loads of great free
information they have a good really
detailed budget planner something that
can be downloaded as a spreadsheet or i
think there might be one you can work on
online as well
so there’s loads of great options
on there um and it’s really just about
finding the one that works for that
person right everybody has their own
personal preferences about what they
like there are also loads of really good
mobile apps as well some of which access
your
uh bank details on a kind of read-only
basis and they pretty much like download
your latest transactions and then sort
the data out so anything that’s from
tesco’s gets sorted into groceries
category for example
um
make sure if anybody’s going to use a
mobile app
that they understand the terms and
conditions what they’re signing up to
they’re happy with the privacy and
security of that app
and i
i would just don’t recommend any
specific apps
um because a lot of them now come with
financial products attached to them
which means you’re edging into that area
of am i giving advice
um but you can certainly tell people
that there are lots of these apps exist
and they can be really helpful
okay
hopefully you’re all good it’s all gone
really quiet in the chat again so give
me a thumbs up say hi
um if there is
um anything that you want to give me any
thoughts on what we’ve said so far let’s
talk about boosting income and cutting
costs because it’s all very well making
a plan but you have to make that plan
balance and do the best you can to have
the income side going up and the cost
side’s lower so that we’re not
in an unbalanced situation and spending
more than we have coming in
so first place to look i’d suggest if
people
need to get an income boost
is turn to us dot org dot uk we’ll look
at that a little bit more a bit later on
in the training
turn to us
is a website with loads of information
about benefits
and just raising income in general um
especially anybody with a family or a
young family should get in the habit of
checking their benefits entitlement at
least once a year
um
unless you’re on a really comfortable
income and i know there are plenty of
fishers who do earn a really comfortable
income
it’s good idea to check regularly
because the system changes all the time
so what somebody’s entitled to might
change and you could miss out if you’re
not checking regularly
so you can do that do a personalized
check find out what you’re entitled to
um i know we’ve got some great people
from fisherman’s mission here local
fishermen’s mission um representatives
uh potentially can help with applying
for grants
so if somebody’s really struggling and
potentially a charitable grant might be
a good solution for them
for example to meet some you know
one-off unexpected expense
that could be a solution for them
i know that there are opportunities
sometimes for grants to get things like
fuel bills written off if somebody’s got
fuel arrears
um as in as in electricity and gas areas
or um home
oil heating areas um i know that water
arrears can sometimes be written off
sometimes you can get educational grants
grants for white goods things like
washing machines cookers so there’s lots
of availability potentially out there
and
fish mesh can be as i gabby you’re
called can be a really good place to go
for help with some of that stuff we
always suggest that people have separate
email accounts for things like online
shopping deals and competitions as
opposed to like personal communications
so that if you’re trying to email about
something
um that’s just like personal that you’re
having a chat with somebody somehow um
if you still use email for that
and you’re keeping that separate from
all the marketing emails that you might
get from online shopping deals
competitions that kind of thing and so
you’re not
accidentally getting drawn into spending
money when you weren’t intending to but
do keep an eye on things like shopping
deals and competitions because there can
be ways to get some income
through being on a newsletter or a
mailing list that you would otherwise
miss
um
check out cashback sites like quid co
and topcashback if you have an account
with those you use those click through
from those to somewhere that where
you’re going to do your shopping so you
choose what you’re going to buy first
already
and then use your quidco account
click through or your top cashback
account and click through and buy the
thing you were already gonna buy don’t
use it as an excuse to buy something you
weren’t already gonna buy and you can
get cash back on your purchases often in
the realms of somewhere around it’s only
one to three percent sometimes it can be
higher
um
but those cashbacks can add up quite
quickly particularly if you’re buying
bigger things
um so yeah they can that could be a
really helpful
kind of ongoing little drip drip of
extra money um sometimes you can get
online competitions that could be quite
valuable again
um it’s not a reliable source of income
but it can be quite nice
and um it’s amazing the things that you
can sell on ebay and facebook i’ve known
people who have sold um you know big
packets of um they’ve saved their empty
toilet tubes and sold all these a big
pack of toilet tubes as um craft
materials for example
um so it’s amazing what can be sold on
ebay and facebook um on facebook
marketplace um you would not think
people would buy stuff but but it’s
amazing when you look what people will
buy
okay
um i mentioned already turned to us as
being a really useful website this is
what the site looks like so it’s um a
national charity for helping people with
income i want to particularly highlight
the fact there is this benefits checker
on here
um
and um this is well worth pointing out
as well that people can have set up an
account so that if they don’t have all
the numbers and information they need
when they’re going through the benefits
check the first time
they can have an account and come back
and uh you know continue a calculation
at a later point so that they’re not
um
you know they don’t have to sit down and
do it all at once in one shot and have
all of their information at the same
time
um some others that can be useful
seafarer support is quite a useful
source of information as well can be a
little out of date from time to time and
applying for the grants that you might
find on there is hard work so
fisherman’s mission or sale
would be
my ports of call
for
uh actually making any kind of
applications but just to check out and
see whether there might be something
this is a useful website as a potential
source of information
and then we’ve got some fab websites for
helping to make your money go further um
all of these would be a really good
places to look for information about
money saving of different kinds
which i think a lot of people know about
which so if you want to understand
financial products you want simple
explanations what on earth is an isa
which has a good
set of rundown of information about what
is nicer they also do best buys for lots
of different types of products so if you
want to make sure that you’re buying is
value for money it’s good quality which
is often a really good place to look for
that
money saving expert already mentioned it
already you might recognize martin lewis
from the telly
um
it’s one of the ugliest websites on the
internet but it’s also
absolutely crammed with really great
information and often very good for
latest breaking news around money issues
for ordinary people
so
um what do i do my my gas bill is about
to rise because the fuel crisis right
now
money saving expert probably has some
good information to help understand what
your options are and what might be a
good solution there
um
[Music]
yeah so which so some of it is free some
of it’s not free i would say the
information articles are often free but
whether the best buy stuff is less
likely to be
so i think they’re good for like basic
information
but you’re right there there’s um a lot
that’s also behind a paywall that’s true
um
freegal and freecycle um if you haven’t
heard of these these are local community
groups you sign up for your group in
your local area
and people who have something to give
away
often items of furniture kitchenware
um i got a tent
a brand almost brand new tent to go
camping with um for free people give
away stuff when they have a clear out on
freegle and free cycle and potentially
there’s the opportunity to get some
stuff for free or if you’re having a
clear out you can get ri”